preventing a mess

[joquius]

I like php. Yes I have to admit I admire the way it gives errors and is solvable.
I hate html however. No I can't admire a language which takes at random either % as a percentage of the page or as a percentage of the table it's within. differenciating on each refresh.

In any case, at some point, these must be integrated; And for the sake of not making a mess, I would like to have some sort of template system. Now I can never work this out. For instance a forum script:
I would need the script for each line, for the frame and the window to be entirely seperate in different files. Then I need the variables to be outputted from the db in a certain manner, I can never figure it out.

So has anyone here worked with php and html templates, having php and html completely seperate (oh I wish it was within my realm of knowledge), in a way that the html can be swapped in a, let us say, "civilized" manner?

[Caesar]

I've created a couple of PHP based Template/CMS sites.

However, I'm not exactly clear on what it is you're asking. Maybe we need a little more information as to what your goal is with the script...in terms of functionality (Eg. "I want users to be able to edit the html via a template system").

[.josh]

yeah you're gonna have to be more specific. there are many ways you can minimize mixing the two, but there is no way to 'completely' seperate the two.

[joquius]

well my goal is not for any CMS or any compatable system, just for the sake of clean code I would like to separate html and php in a way where I would simply have the html files as includes. The problem with this is that all my html is full of <? if () ?> and escaping to php. Any ideas? How would you avoid using if queries within a html template?