gc40 Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 Okay guys, I HAD a client in the past that requested I code a website for them. At the time, I was overloaded with work and sub-contracted another web developer company to help me out. They designed a small script to add, edit and delete Net Asset Values on the companies' site. Lets call my client THE COMPANY. Months passed and THE COMPANY contacted me to update their site and make it more dynamic. I met with them and within a few weeks I was contracted to build their new website. I built a complete CMS which allowed the company to edit anything on the website they wished. The guy in charge of dealing with the website at THE COMPANY was very pleased and we eventually signed off on the website and I got paid. The guy that I was dealing with later quit the company. Later that month, I got an email from some staff of the company requesting all kinds of changes that were outside of the scope. Not to mention, we already signed off on the website. I got a deadline for Oct 19th. I was extremely busy and told the company I will try my best, and being the nice guy I am, I would not charge a cent. The changes took me over 2 days. I completed by Oct 28th. I sent the company an email and their response was requesting me to provide all database, ftp and files to THE COMPANY. They hired a new web developer. At first I was a little upset because I made all the changes and took my time out of it and didn't even charge. I was thinking about encrypting my code, but I figured the new web developer was an ethical developer. A few weeks pass by and the company launches their site. I go and check it out. The only thing that has changed is the template!! The coding and structure of the site is still my code. I was fine with this because they wanted a new look. However, when I checked my copyright in the code comments, they had all be removed. Each and every file had its comments removed and copyright removed! Now I was truely upset. He even changed the footer to his company name. I then went to the CMS on THE COMPANY website. Guess what? The CMS was completely UNCHANGED from my coding, but all the copyright, title and information containing my companies' info was changes to HIS COMPANY! The title of the CMS was MYCOMPANY.COM CMS, he changed it to HISCOMPANY.com CMS!! Now I am truely pissed off. I look up this guy in the whois and got his contact information. I call him. To my suprise I find out he is the coder at the sub-contracted company I used months ago for the original website. He quit the sub-contract company and started his own company. When I tell him my situation and what he is doing is illegal, he tells me, well, one part of the website is my code. I ask what he is talking about.... He says that the Net Asset Value script was designed by him at the sub-contract company. Remember guys, the Net Asset Value (NAV) script is one script of over 30 different scripts I have on the CMS. I tell him that #1. He was an employee at the sub-contract company, so anything he did belong to that company and not him, and #2. I used the subcontract company to help me develop the original site. Meaning all source code given to me was mine to change and manipulate as per my agreement with the sub-contract company. I then email him and THE COMPANY asking that the copyright be changed back to my name. He replied saying he refuses to do so because his company and mine are not affiliated. I am about to type my response, but I have no idea what to say. I do not want to start a war, but at the same time, what is mine is mine. Please advise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooldude832 Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 This is a php help forum not lets talk about our bussiness problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gc40 Posted December 1, 2007 Author Share Posted December 1, 2007 Good reply, can moderator move this to somewhere on the website where it can be discussed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooldude832 Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 This isn't the arena for your problems, try a lawyer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gc40 Posted December 1, 2007 Author Share Posted December 1, 2007 Wow, dude get off. Let moderators deal with it. You are one of those people that must reply for the sake of your post count. Brother, I have a problem and need a solution or advice from fellow developers. Please understand this and do not reply cooldude. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooldude832 Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 I read the bits and pieces of this, if you can annotate your 500 words to like 50 someone might help, but anyway this is my actual response. If you had a legit copy right to your work that was approved by a sanctioned body of the government in your jurisdiction, and the infringing party lies within the scope of the jurisdictional limit of your above stated copyright, they you have a legal foot to stand on and seek retribution for your damages. However because there is no actual documented damage that can be assigned, a numerical value, the amount of retribution claimed could only be determined by an arbitrator, which will be fairlesss than you belive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gc40 Posted December 1, 2007 Author Share Posted December 1, 2007 Thank you cooldude. Thats the kind of response I was looking for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooldude832 Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 Too bad the infringing party probaly lies outside the scope of your jurisdiction, and the retribution you can expect are < $1000 usd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gc40 Posted December 1, 2007 Author Share Posted December 1, 2007 I am still lost, do I have any legal grounds at all? They are not denying that I did developed the site CMS, they just arn't changing back the copyright. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHP_PhREEEk Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 Advice: Did you have a written contract with THE COMPANY for the original work? If so, in that contract, did you explicitly imply that you retain the copyright of your scripts? If not, and I do mean it needs to be clearly spelled out, then you lose. Once the company paid you, and without anything written to protect your intellectual property, the company has reasonable right to retain possession of everything they paid for, and either modify or transfer those intellectual rights to a different third party if they wish to. If you do have something in writing that protects your work in any way whatsoever, then that document will need to be examined by an attorney who specializes in Intellectual Rights. Be prepared to shell out a minimum of $10k US to retain them. I have been through this before, so my advice is, unless you have 10 grand laying around, get top dollar for your work and walk away from it. Even having something in writing does not guarantee someone won't try to jack you over, and if they do, it will cost you more than it's worth to have an attorney send them a cease and desist, and then get a temporary restraining order pending trial. Your best bet at this point (in all seriousness), is to contract an attorney for the sole purpose of sending THE COMPANY and the new software foo a letter on the attorney's letterhead, hoping they will comply out of fear of lawsuit. If they blink, however, you have to then decide what value pursuing this would have for you. If it's just ego, that gets expensive. If you can prove that your proprietary code makes you consistent money (and again, this has to be PROVEN, not just stated), then you might be awarded damages. PhREEEk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gc40 Posted December 1, 2007 Author Share Posted December 1, 2007 Good reply. I guess I will just drop it. But isn't that a piss off that people can just walk all over you and there is nothing you can do without hurting yourself? Unethical bastards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phpSensei Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 This is a php help section, please abide by the rules and take this somewhere else. It is like posting about foods in a mechanics forum, which really makes no sense. This isnt for the sake of my post count because I really don't care, as long as I can help others with "PHP" and not their personal buisness, I am fine with this community. Get a lawyer, and sue the company my friend. If you can find evidence that you coded the application/website for them, then you can take them down. I also would have kept information to their MYSQL/ftp connection, so you can show the HOST PROVIDER if the company used that information. If they send you a letter saying "yes", and you have all the coding, then thats enough. I just read pieces of what you said, correct me if I am wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sKunKbad Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 I'd say that if you didn't have a contractual agreement with THE COMPANY that said that they would retain your copyright info in the template, then you are out of luck. I'm not a lawyer though, and honestly I don't know if it is really worth dealing with in court. My lawyer (for other personal matters) costs $200 per hour USD, and thats actually pretty cheap as far as lawyers go. If you go to court, and this takes a long time (and many court cases do), you might find your total attorney's fees upwards of $50,000. Mine even charges me for phone calls! If you are dealing with unethical individuals, they will most likely lie and twist the truth to the point that all you will be doing is wasting your time and energy. Can you prove that you sold THE COMPANY the exact files that you sold them, and that the files were in some way documented to contain code that was produced soley by you and you alone? It's just a big mess. Since the other guy worked with you, and did produce some of the code, it all comes down to the contract you had with THE COMPANY. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GingerRobot Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 Advice: Did you have a written contract with THE COMPANY for the original work? If so, in that contract, did you explicitly imply... How can something be explicitly implicit? Oh, and cooldude, sometimes you really do need to restrain yourself with your clicking of the post button. Please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHP_PhREEEk Posted December 1, 2007 Share Posted December 1, 2007 How can something be explicitly implicit? By directly dictating, of course! ;P ;P PhREEEk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenway Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Anyone who steals code isn't competent enough to post a problem for you as competition... let it go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liquid Fire Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Well if you are building script for another company you need to have a contract the specifically says that you retain copyright to all of your code, otherwise i believe you are SOL(I'm an not lawyer tho). I mean if I were to build a CMS I would probably want to retain the ciopyright to it so I might be able to use it in a later project or something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenway Posted December 4, 2007 Share Posted December 4, 2007 If you can build it once, you can build it again... and better the next time 'round. The guy who steals your stuff won't have a clue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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