mformatt Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 Hello - having worked in PHP for two years I am noticing patterns in website development. A lot of our clients designs are quite similar and require the same kind of things. For example a two column layout, and common backend CMS features. Has anyone had enough experience with PHP to learn how to optimize their development so that they are starting to learn how to quickly move from Photoshop (PSD) files to a repeatable template to using a CMS product such as Drupal or Joomla. I would really like to pump out these sites at a much faster rate without building them from scratch and encountering my own PHP and Javascript errors. Actually I would like to limit the technology used (Ajax) in favour of more reliability and faster development. So far I am using Dreamweaver for template design and as an IDE. I am considering Drupal or Joomla to look after the backend. Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/119244-professional-fast-site-development/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeypaw201 Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 Personally speaking, I try to keep my database structure very similar and have a repository or scripts i made ahead of time, so its just a bit of copy/paste and modify a couple minor things... It helps because like you mentioned alot of websites require the standard "stuff" Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/119244-professional-fast-site-development/#findComment-614195 Share on other sites More sharing options...
genericnumber1 Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 I've over time created my own framework with repositories of plugins I can copy/paste the controllers/models for. For instance, I have a blog plugin I've used for multiple sites, it's just an issue of editing the view (template files) to match the layout and I'm done. You might consider something like that as it really speeds the development of the repetitive things most people want in a site. Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/119244-professional-fast-site-development/#findComment-614196 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mformatt Posted August 12, 2008 Author Share Posted August 12, 2008 what about cms tools like drupal and even services such as psd2html, i think a lot of programmers are quite proud of their 'raw' programmings skills but I think it would be useful to companies if programmers would learn to outsource to services such as psd2html and important themes into drupal cutting production time. Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/119244-professional-fast-site-development/#findComment-614205 Share on other sites More sharing options...
genericnumber1 Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 I'm sure this is true, and I know many programmers who use things like drupal. Unfortunately I don't, so I don't know was just throwing in my 2 cents. Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/119244-professional-fast-site-development/#findComment-614210 Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeypaw201 Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 Yes, but using a CMS kind of takes away from what they hired you for ... you are then standardizing the entire internet (eventually) and there would be no "true" uniqueness.. They could just install it themselves at that point.. Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/119244-professional-fast-site-development/#findComment-614212 Share on other sites More sharing options...
tibberous Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 It's not that great. By using a CMS, you have a large system to work around, and the client thinks less of what you are doing. It took me just as long to make my site from a Joomla template as it would have to write it from scratch, but the client is still going to think, "All I did was pay him to setup Joomla, I could have done that" Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/119244-professional-fast-site-development/#findComment-614222 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mformatt Posted August 12, 2008 Author Share Posted August 12, 2008 Thank you for replying, here are my responses to the above posts Yes, but using a CMS kind of takes away from what they hired you for ... you are then standardizing the entire internet (eventually) and there would be no "true" uniqueness.. They could just install it themselves at that point.. I was hired to create a reliable website that does what my client wants it to do! I think I can create something much faster, much more reliable by using a framework where all the bugs have already been thought of, occured, and ironed out. It just seems stupid to create things from scratch. I used to use editplus for the PHP now I use dreamweaver. It's not that great. By using a CMS, you have a large system to work around, and the client thinks less of what you are doing. It took me just as long to make my site from a Joomla template as it would have to write it from scratch, but the client is still going to think, "All I did was pay him to setup Joomla, I could have done that" It takes you just as long to create a website from scratch as it does in Joomla. A website using Joomla uses thousands of lines of bug tested code. I am looking for methods to go from designer (something I cant do) to finished product in the least amount of time possible. Currently I am considering 1) designer creates mock up 2) design goes to psd2html ($200) that creates bug free cross-browser reliable xhtml/css 3) images/css/xhtml are imported as a joomla/drupal template 4) features are added to meet the clients requirements. Existing code is transferred from any clients who have had the same requirements. as a result the site 1) works on all browsers 2) uses a tested framework so there is less testing/debugging/fixing time 3) features have been implemented as required and the site is delivered Okay, now I only have 2 years experience. Please let me know what you think of this theory in practice. Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/119244-professional-fast-site-development/#findComment-614275 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel0 Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 I hate Drupal and Joomla! (who puts punctuation in their name anyways?) because not only do I think they're horrible scripts, but you will probably have to modify a lot of code so you could've just started with a good framework like Zend Framework. I also agree with tibberous's point. Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/119244-professional-fast-site-development/#findComment-614278 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ardyandkari Posted August 12, 2008 Share Posted August 12, 2008 I hate Drupal and Joomla! (who puts punctuation in their name anyways?) i want to change my user name to ardy&kari!!! jk i do agree that if you are going to be charging a good amt of money for a site, you should put your all into it and not use a cms... that said, i have done some sites where i suggested that the owner use a cms (wordpress) because it can save me time i charge MUCH less i might charge $300-$500 for a scratch built site, where i might set up wordpress for $100 plus any fees i may incur (price doesnt include hosting or domain name...anything like that) basically, if they pay for it, give it to them. Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/119244-professional-fast-site-development/#findComment-615111 Share on other sites More sharing options...
tibberous Posted August 13, 2008 Share Posted August 13, 2008 The thing is, Joomla is a lot more complex than anything you'd every write because it is designed to be extensible and flexible for people who don't know how to code. It isn't like the idea is new or revolutionary, but if you plan on outsourcing a project to three different people, "importing" a layout as a joomla template, expecting the code from psd2html to be bug free, and thinking that Joomla will give you less debugging / fixing time, I think your going to end up being let down and heavily underbidding it. Why don't you go, find a simple site, and actually try to make it with Joomla? See how long it takes you, at least then you can see how well your plan will work and how long it will take and what to charge. Have an idea of how you want the site to be before you start - because your clients are going too. I'm not trying to bash your idea, but I actually made my site (trenttompkins.com) in Joomla. It took two weeks and I started with a real Joomla template. If you are just trying to make a website, Joomla is great -- if you want to make a website a certain way, Joomla is less great. If you want to make a website that doesn't look and feel like it was made in Joomla, don't use Joomla Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/119244-professional-fast-site-development/#findComment-615861 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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