Looking for a book to design website properly

[fixxxer]

Hey,

Ive been learning php and have built several very bad sites and while i feel my php coding is improving all the time, i struggle with actual web site design. Not the appearance of the site but the actual design process. As ive had no formal training, i dont how to plan a website from scratch i tend to start a website and then constantly think of things to add, and forget things.

Im looking for a book that shows how to design a website. things like flow charts etc.. it doesn't have to be specific to php but id like to get an idea of how a website is designed by professionals.

Can anyone offer some advice. Even a tutorial off the net might help

thanks.

[Nameless12]

I think php5 objects, patterns and practice by apress would be a good book for you depending on your skill level of course I found I did not learn much when I read it as I knew most of the stuff but for you that may be different.

http://www.apress.com/book/bookDisplay.html?bID=358

[jcombs_31]

Honestly, I don't think a book can teach you to design a site.  You need to just keep trying over and over. Keep looking around for inspiration and see how others do it.  I think the first few sites I ever attempted all looked horrible.

[Daniel0]

[quote author=jcombs_31 link=topic=123063.msg508522#msg508522 date=1169209773]
Honestly, I don't think a book can teach you to design a site.  You need to just keep trying over and over. Keep looking around for inspiration and see how others do it.  I think the first few sites I ever attempted all looked horrible.
[/quote]
He said he can make the design, but he is not aware of how he would make it into a website. That is at least how I read it. If that is the case, then I guess that a book is able to teach you it.

[quote author=Nameless12 link=topic=123063.msg508388#msg508388 date=1169179756]
I think php5 objects, patterns and practice by apress would be a good book for you depending on your skill level of course I found I did not learn much when I read it as I knew most of the stuff but for you that may be different.

http://www.apress.com/book/bookDisplay.html?bID=358
[/quote]
He is talking about web design, not programming/coding design patterns.

[jcombs_31]

[quote author=Daniel0 link=topic=123063.msg508557#msg508557 date=1169214901]
[quote author=jcombs_31 link=topic=123063.msg508522#msg508522 date=1169209773]
Honestly, I don't think a book can teach you to design a site.  You need to just keep trying over and over. Keep looking around for inspiration and see how others do it.  I think the first few sites I ever attempted all looked horrible.
[/quote]
He said he can make the design, but he is not aware of how he would make it into a website. That is at least how I read it. If that is the case, then I guess that a book is able to teach you it.

[quote author=Nameless12 link=topic=123063.msg508388#msg508388 date=1169179756]
I think php5 objects, patterns and practice by apress would be a good book for you depending on your skill level of course I found I did not learn much when I read it as I knew most of the stuff but for you that may be different.

http://www.apress.com/book/bookDisplay.html?bID=358
[/quote]
He is talking about web design, not programming/coding design patterns.
[/quote]

He's talking about the overall process.  That is why I said to keep practicing because reading will never be the same as hands on.

[redbullmarky]

i'm with jcombs on this one. IMO, appearance and the design process both go very much hand in hand as far as the final result goes, but with anything artistic, there isn't really a process or a set of stages to go through. Much of anything arty is trial an error - be it drawing, design, music, whatever.
I'm still very far off being good at the design side of things, but definitely getting better; I find the best way is to pull my favourite sites apart, look at the code+CSS and find out what works and why, but most importantly I find the colour scheme the one to pay the most attention to and the one I find I struggle with the most.
As for actually putting it together, I always find it helps putting together a skeleton of a HTML page with a bit of CSS, and then mould a page from there - otherwise, it's a free-for-all process, really...