Managing Photo Uploads

[doubledee]

Currently I have an "upload_photo.php" script that allows Members to upload a photo to be displayed in their Profile.

 

I have went to great lengths to ensure that a legitimate photo file is uploaded, and had several people check my code and have received a "thumbs up", so all seemed done.

 

However, over the last few days it has occurred to me I forgot something...

 

What if a person uploads a *naughty* Photo?! 

 

And thus the purpose of this thread...

 

What advice can you offer as far as a good way to regulate what Photo Content is uploaded to Members' Profiles?

 

I was thinking of adding a field in my "member" table called "photo_approved", and when they upload a new Photo, that field would be set to "No" and some default "Photo Pending Approval" blank is served up until I have had time to physically review (and approve) the New Photo.

 

What do you think about that?

 

Suggestions?

 

Thanks,

 

 

Debbie

 

 

[Skewled]

That is the only way I know to make sure no naughty pictures are uploaded for a profile, outside of that maybe some advanced image detector could be coded to analyze the image for those naughty parts.. but that's way beyond me lol!

[doubledee]

That is the only way I know to make sure no naughty pictures are uploaded for a profile, outside of that maybe some advanced image detector could be coded to analyze the image for those naughty parts.. but that's way beyond me lol!

 

You're missing the point...

 

I never said that I wanted my script to *look* at the Photos.  (It's pretty obvious a human needs to do that?!)

 

I was just asking about what would make sense both from a workflow standpoint, as well as a Front-End and back-End standpoint.

 

 

 

Debbie

 

[kicken]

Really it depends on how much work and time you want to invest into the proccess.  Do you want to manually review every photo before it is allowed?  Then do like you said and set a flag to no on upload and email yourself or build some kind of admin queue interface (or both).  When you approve the image have a script toggle the flag so the photo is then allowed.  Until it is allowed you can either

a) Continue serving the old image (if one exists) or

b) Serve some type of placeholder.  This could be a plain silhouette image, a gravatar, or whatever really.

 

The other option is to let the community police itself and just implement some type of report image function. Then whenever people see a bad photo they can report it.  This would email you a notice about the photo so you can review it and then take it down if necessary.  You'd have the same type of approval flag on the image in the setup, except it would initial be set to on and you would toggle it to off either after a report or after a review.

 

[doubledee]

Really it depends on how much work and time you want to invest into the proccess.  Do you want to manually review every photo before it is allowed?

 

Shouldn't I?

 

 

The other option is to let the community police itself and just implement some type of report image function. Then whenever people see a bad photo they can report it.  This would email you a notice about the photo so you can review it and then take it down if necessary.  You'd have the same type of approval flag on the image in the setup, except it would initial be set to on and you would toggle it to off either after a report or after a review.

 

Isn't that riskier?

 

 

Debbie

 

 

[Adam]

Personally, I really hate it when websites/services over-police their content. The PS3 is perhaps the perfect example of this; they star out any string that's remotely offensive to anyone in messages. It's ridiculous. It doesn't even match whole words, you can be writing a genuine message but because it finds "ass" in "bass", it'll star it out. Then you have to rewrite it, creatively replacing letters to get around the filter.

 

My point being I'm a grown man, I'm allowed to throw the odd F-bomb amongst friends, and if I find something offensive I can handle it. I don't need a website to protect me. With the PS3 however I'm kind of tied to it; I'd have to re-invest in a new console to go with a competitor. A website is completely different though, I could easily go somewhere else if I'm having daft restrictions forced on me like a child.

 

Obviously in contrast to that you have to protect your website's image. You don't want it riddled with filth, if filth-seekers aren't your target audience. If that is the case though, you can't punish those genuine users by making your service slow and unusable, on the off chance someone may upload something unsuitable.

 

Just allow the community to report to you what they think is inappropriate.

[scootstah]

Here's the options that I thought of real quick:

1. As mentioned, you can run the images through an analyzer to check for nudity or whatever. Maybe instead of disallowing any images that trip it, have it alert you so you can manually review only those images that bothered it. You'll probably get a lot of false positives, and probably a lot of images will slip through anyway - but it's a good first line of defense.

 

2. Manually review all images. This is pretty tedious and overly unnecessary IMO. I've been apart of a lot of large forums and community sites, and I really don't think any of them ever did this. If someone uploaded something indecent or against their ToS, it was reported and dealt with. It never became a problem. And no offense, but these sites were likely orders of magnitude larger in terms of user-base than yours will be.

 

3. Allow other users to report offending users.

 

Personally, I would go with option 3 and leave it at that. It is unlikely to become a big enough problem to worry about it.

[doubledee]

Obviously in contrast to that you have to protect your website's image.

 

Key point! 

 

 

You don't want it riddled with filth, if filth-seekers aren't your target audience. If that is the case though, you can't punish those genuine users by making your service slow and unusable, on the off chance someone may upload something unsuitable.

 

I see your point, but still personally don't think I'm being too demanding on Photos.

 

It would be a lot more work, but I like the idea of a "points/post system" where after so many points/posts you can upload what you want.  (If I recall, PHPFreaks makes you wait 25 posts before you get to choice your avatar, right?)

 

 

Now not to make this thread fork and explode, but I think your points above are more valid for a second, related issue I have...

 

Do I require that I review User Comments before they become available?  (My plan for now is, Yes!)

 

 

Just allow the community to report to you what they think is inappropriate.

 

Maybe there is the catch...

 

In order to establish a "baseline", a "community", and "community self-policing", you need a COMMUNITY!!  (Then again, you need some freedom to build that community.)

 

I am leaning towards policing things in the beginning, and then like your teenager, as people prove they are trustworthy, loosen up my pre-screening requirements.

 

Personally I don't see why it is a big deal to wait 12-24 for a Photo to appear.

 

Are people that ADHC-ish that they can't wait? 

 

And are people that obsessed, that they won't contribute content to the site unless the whole world can instantly see their mugshot?!

 

If this was a Dating Website, where you're in a hurry to get l _ _ d, maybe...  (Oops!  Did I say that?!) 

 

 

Debbie

 

[doubledee]

Here's the options that I thought of real quick:

1. As mentioned, you can run the images through an analyzer to check for nudity or whatever. Maybe instead of disallowing any images that trip it, have it alert you so you can manually review only those images that bothered it. You'll probably get a lot of false positives, and probably a lot of images will slip through anyway - but it's a good first line of defense.

 

If any such software exists, it cost millions!!

 

 

2. Manually review all images. This is pretty tedious and overly unnecessary IMO. I've been apart of a lot of large forums and community sites, and I really don't think any of them ever did this. If someone uploaded something indecent or against their ToS, it was reported and dealt with. It never became a problem. And no offense, but these sites were likely orders of magnitude larger in terms of user-base than yours will be.

 

I KNOW my site will be tiny for a long time.  No arguments there.

 

 

3. Allow other users to report offending users.

 

So what would I have to build in order to make that a reality?

 

Can you give me a business flow of how it would work?

 

Can you give me a high-level technical overview of how it would work.

 

Sounds like I'd have to modify all of my webpages... 

 

 

Personally, I would go with option 3 and leave it at that. It is unlikely to become a big enough problem to worry about it.

 

So changing topic for a moment...

 

What do you think about User Content?

 

I currently allow Registered Users to post Comments beneath my Articles (like most online newspapers do).

 

Right now I have it set so I have to approve all Comments before they appear beneath an Article.

 

Extreme?  I don't think so...  Just check out any online newspaper or magazine that allows Comments without monitoring, and you will see a book of SPAM and TRASH!!!

 

(Not to get all "snobby" on you guys, but I am trying to build a website and community that is filled with predominantly college-educated, professionals, in their late 20's and upwards.  I want *intelligent* conversations about my intelligent Articles.  Definitely not your typical Teen, or Developer, or Gamer Website!!!)

 

Down the road, I can see building a "Points System" where good behavior is rewards and restraints are taken off.  But for a New Site, with New Users, and No Community or Mods, I think it is reasonable to have to "approve" Comments before they appear.

 

I would also like to point out that it would be a GOOD PROBLEM if there are more Photo Uploads and User Comments than I have time to monitor...

 

But, as I see it, but regulating things upfront, I will attract the audience I ultimately want, and as new people come to my site, they will be like, "Wow, this is some thought-provoking Content and Discussions, and it has the serious types of Users that will bring me back.  It definitely is a higher-caliber site than most..."

 

Follow me?

 

 

Debbie

 

 

[scootstah]

Here's the options that I thought of real quick:

1. As mentioned, you can run the images through an analyzer to check for nudity or whatever. Maybe instead of disallowing any images that trip it, have it alert you so you can manually review only those images that bothered it. You'll probably get a lot of false positives, and probably a lot of images will slip through anyway - but it's a good first line of defense.

 

If any such software exists, it cost millions!!

 

http://www.phpclasses.org/package/3269-PHP-Determine-whether-an-image-may-contain-nudity.html

 

Free. And that was only about 30 seconds on Google, I'm sure others exist.

 

3. Allow other users to report offending users.

 

So what would I have to build in order to make that a reality?

 

Add a "report abuse" link (or something similar) to the profile page. When a user clicks it, they can fill out a brief summary of why there was abuse, and then you will be alerted (email, SMS, a little button on your admin page, whatever) and you can deal with it accordingly.

 

Personally, I would go with option 3 and leave it at that. It is unlikely to become a big enough problem to worry about it.

 

So changing topic for a moment...

 

What do you think about User Content?

 

I currently allow Registered Users to post Comments beneath my Articles (like most online newspapers do).

 

Right now I have it set so I have to approve all Comments before they appear beneath an Article.

 

I manually approve comments for my blog as well, at least for now. It is a new blog and so doesn't have much (if any) traffic and I've only received two comments so far. Not a big deal for me to login and accept them, and it completely eliminates spam.

 

However if it were to get relatively large where I am getting several comments a day or something, I would probably change it up to allowing comments automatically and then letting people flag them for abuse/spam. I would also take additional steps to annoy users to try to prevent spam.

[Adam]

In order to establish a "baseline", a "community", and "community self-policing", you need a COMMUNITY!!  (Then again, you need some freedom to build that community.)

 

And to attract the kind of users you're looking to protect against, you need a community.

 

Extreme?  I don't think so...  Just check out any online newspaper or magazine that allows Comments without monitoring, and you will see a book of SPAM and TRASH!!!

 

(Not to get all "snobby" on you guys, but I am trying to build a website and community that is filled with predominantly college-educated, professionals, in their late 20's and upwards.  I want *intelligent* conversations about my intelligent Articles.  Definitely not your typical Teen, or Developer, or Gamer Website!!!)

 

Those arguments don't really hold up. You don't need to moderate comments to prevent SPAM, and you would assume your professional readers aren't going to post comments you would consider inappropriate, or upload naked photos of themselves.

 

But, as I see it, but regulating things upfront, I will attract the audience I ultimately want, and as new people come to my site, they will be like, "Wow, this is some thought-provoking Content and Discussions, and it has the serious types of Users that will bring me back.  It definitely is a higher-caliber site than most..."

 

Then I would stop worrying about trivial issues like this, until you actually have a reason to, and concentrate on your content. That's what makes a site!

[doubledee]

3. Allow other users to report offending users.

 

So what would I have to build in order to make that a reality?

 

Add a "report abuse" link (or something similar) to the profile page. When a user clicks it, they can fill out a brief summary of why there was abuse, and then you will be alerted (email, SMS, a little button on your admin page, whatever) and you can deal with it accordingly.

 

What is the "report abuse" sending me?

 

An ID?

 

A URL?

 

Something else?

 

 

So changing topic for a moment...

 

What do you think about User Content?

 

I currently allow Registered Users to post Comments beneath my Articles (like most online newspapers do).

 

Right now I have it set so I have to approve all Comments before they appear beneath an Article.

 

I manually approve comments for my blog as well, at least for now. It is a new blog and so doesn't have much (if any) traffic and I've only received two comments so far. Not a big deal for me to login and accept them, and it completely eliminates spam.

 

So you have an issue with me wanting to approve your Photos, but not necessarily your Comments?

 

 

However if it were to get relatively large where I am getting several comments a day or something, I would probably change it up to allowing comments automatically and then letting people flag them for abuse/spam. I would also take additional steps to annoy users to try to prevent spam.

 

And how would you "annoy users to try and prevent spam"??

 

 

Debbie

 

[doubledee]

Those arguments don't really hold up. You don't need to moderate comments to prevent SPAM, and you would assume your professional readers aren't going to post comments you would consider inappropriate, or upload naked photos of themselves.

 

It takes professionals to attract professionals and deter bored teens...

 

It's "Chicken and Egg".

 

 

But, as I see it, but regulating things upfront, I will attract the audience I ultimately want, and as new people come to my site, they will be like, "Wow, this is some thought-provoking Content and Discussions, and it has the serious types of Users that will bring me back.  It definitely is a higher-caliber site than most..."

 

Then I would stop worrying about trivial issues like this, until you actually have a reason to, and concentrate on your content. That's what makes a site!

 

So I hear you saying "Don't pre-screen Photo Uploads or User Comments until you have reason to"  Right?

 

 

And what about preventing SPAM?

 

 

 

Debbie

 

[scootstah]

3. Allow other users to report offending users.

 

So what would I have to build in order to make that a reality?

 

Add a "report abuse" link (or something similar) to the profile page. When a user clicks it, they can fill out a brief summary of why there was abuse, and then you will be alerted (email, SMS, a little button on your admin page, whatever) and you can deal with it accordingly.

 

What is the "report abuse" sending me?

 

An ID?

 

A URL?

 

Something else?

 

Come on, use your imagination. You are the coder, make it send you whatever you need it to send you. It could just say "Joe's profile has been reported for abuse" and then click it to see the brief summary they filled out.

 

And how would you "annoy users to try and prevent spam"??

 

Some form of a captcha most likely.

[doubledee]

And how would you "annoy users to try and prevent spam"??

 

Some form of a captcha most likely.

 

Well, right now you have to be a Registered member, and you have to be Logged In to post a Comment, so isn't that enough?

 

Or should I add CAPTCHA on top of that?

 

 

Debbie

 

[scootstah]

And how would you "annoy users to try and prevent spam"??

 

Some form of a captcha most likely.

 

Well, right now you have to be a Registered member, and you have to be Logged In to post a Comment, so isn't that enough?

 

Or should I add CAPTCHA on top of that?

 

 

Debbie

 

 

No, you're probably fine. I was just talking about blog, in which I don't require registration for commenting.

[doubledee]

So, to wrap up, it sounds like the Peanut Gallery is saying...

 

- Let Users upload Photos of what they want without pre-screening

 

- Let User post Comments of what they want without pre-screening

 

- Trust your Users

 

- Build a Community and let them self-regulate

 

- Create a "Flag Photo/Content" button, and let others report questionable Photos/Content

 

 

Debbie

 

 

[scootstah]

Pretty much.

 

If it starts to become a problem, find a few people or users you can trust and grant them some moderator privileges. Enough to remove posts or edit user profiles or something.

 

I'm sure this site gets quite a bit of spam, but I hardly ever see any of it because of the large and awesome mod team.

[Philip]

I'm sure this site gets quite a bit of spam, but I hardly ever see any of it because of the large and awesome mod team.

 

The stuff we miss, a user usually reports and it is gone within a 10min of being posted. It's been like this on any site I've worked on.

[scootstah]

I'm sure this site gets quite a bit of spam, but I hardly ever see any of it because of the large and awesome mod team.

 

The stuff we miss, a user usually reports and it is gone within a 10min of being posted. It's been like this on any site I've worked on.

 

So now I'm actually curious. How many spam posts are deleted per week?