jsschmitt Posted June 22, 2009 Share Posted June 22, 2009 Ok... contemplated posting it in the freelance section, but decided against it after realizing that it would make me a jerk of sorts. My sister and her husband have a business that I built and maintain the website for. I haven't charged them for anything yet (besides hosting), and have decided that the time has come that I should be charging them for agreed upon modifications/updates. Here is the thing... I have no clue where to begin when it comes to rates. This is the site: http://www.digitalephemeraphotography.com Most of the "difficult" stuff is in the admin section. I have done the following pro-bono: Built the entire site from the ground up. (Flash galleries were built by 3rd party software) Built a small CMS allowing for easy update of the "Selected Ephemera" page. Built a small CMS to allow for the easy upload of a new flash gallery. This is the first thing I am doing, and would like to charge them for: Modifying the flash galleries to look at a PHP file, built from the images folder (no more .xml, means no more need to re-upload the WHOLE gallery) Build a small CMS to allow upload of new images into a specific gallery - requires also adding a chunk to create a thumbnail and add to the gallery Build a small CMS to allow the ability to remove images from a specific gallery - requires also adding a chunk to remove the thumbnail from that gallery Here is what I am looking for from you folks. What would you charge to do it? Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/163259-question-about-rates/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
ober Posted June 22, 2009 Share Posted June 22, 2009 Charge them $300 for pain and suffering, then install wordpress with some plug-ins to save yourself a lot of time re-inventing the wheel. Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/163259-question-about-rates/#findComment-861346 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsschmitt Posted June 22, 2009 Author Share Posted June 22, 2009 ...then install wordpress with some plug-ins to save yourself a lot of time re-inventing the wheel. Eh, I prefer to re-invent the wheel when it makes it more idiot-friendly. I already have wordpress installed, and he continues to use his blogspot blog. Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/163259-question-about-rates/#findComment-861357 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ober Posted June 22, 2009 Share Posted June 22, 2009 Then you haven't made it worth his while. Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/163259-question-about-rates/#findComment-861469 Share on other sites More sharing options...
PugJr Posted June 22, 2009 Share Posted June 22, 2009 Also always make it harder than it seems to be. You never ever EVER act modest in the coding world. Most people who expect some code have no clue about the effort required and if you act modest, he will assume its easy. Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/163259-question-about-rates/#findComment-861568 Share on other sites More sharing options...
.josh Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 Also always make it harder than it seems to be. You never ever EVER act modest in the coding world. Most people who expect some code have no clue about the effort required and if you act modest, he will assume its easy. To kind of half-reiterate, half-clarify, most non-coders (and even a lot of coders apparently) believe there really is some magic wand out there that allows you to instantly do anything and everything under the sun. Well as you (should) know, that's not true, even when it's just you working on a system you control. Don't even get me started on throwing multiple people into the mix, working on scripts to which you have no access to shit... So to reiterate...never ever EVER make out like something is simple, even if it turned out to be that way. It WILL come back to haunt you. But anyways, to get to the point of your post... kind of hard for us to give you a fair price. I mean, you're already doing stuff for free because they are family... how much would you charge a regular client? My personal take on it is as long as it's not cutting into your money-making time, hey, that's what family is for. But on the other hand, if they are making lots of $$ off this...it's fair to ask for some kind of cut. Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/163259-question-about-rates/#findComment-861590 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy-H Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 For a start I would definately drop the tabular layout and inject a little SEO into the mix. Even simple stuff like using proper heading tags and paragraph tags following each <h?> tag. If I was making a website for a family member I wouldn't charge and would use a little spare time for programming. Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/163259-question-about-rates/#findComment-861633 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsschmitt Posted June 23, 2009 Author Share Posted June 23, 2009 The issue is this: I don't have a problem doing random stuff for free, like something I just decided to do to test my ability, or because I wanted to honestly test out a chunk of code/layout I found. i.e. I found the iPhone/iPod design kit, and modified it to fit their site. Now, when you visit the site on either, you get the modified site. - Did they ask for it? No. Did they need it? Not specifically (although the flash galleries wouldn't play on the iPhone/iPod). Did I do it in my spare time because I wanted to? Yes. The situation comes down to: The modifications I would be making aren't required. I could leave it the way it is and he would have to reupload the entire gallery EVERY time he wanted to add/remove even one picture. Not to sound rude (cause I really don't want to!), but I'm not looking for opinions on site-design, just on the concept of charging. My sister made the statement that they would just "go somewhere else", because I mentioned about charging. I am looking for "quotes" in an effort to show her that, yeah, she can go somewhere else, but it's just going to cost her WAY more then I would have ever charged! Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/163259-question-about-rates/#findComment-861642 Share on other sites More sharing options...
corbin Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 Yeah, I would probably just tell her to go find someone else then. Does she really think she's going to find someone willing to do it for free? Weird. Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/163259-question-about-rates/#findComment-861725 Share on other sites More sharing options...
zq29 Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 My sister made the statement that they would just "go somewhere else", because I mentioned about charging. Yeah, I would probably just tell her to go find someone else then. Yeah, I wouldn't take that shit either. Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/163259-question-about-rates/#findComment-861741 Share on other sites More sharing options...
.josh Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 My sister made the statement that they would just "go somewhere else", because I mentioned about charging. Okay somehow I doubt that your sister is stupid enough to think that she's going to get a better deal than free. So if she's saying this, that means 1 or 2 things (or both): 1) She thinks that by you saying you want to charge her, what you're really saying is you don't want to help her at all 2) She thinks your work sucks and the only reason she's taking it is because it's free and if she's going to have to pay for something, she'd rather get it done by someone who knows what they are doing. Well, that's how I would interpret it if it were my sister saying that to me, anyways :/ Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/163259-question-about-rates/#findComment-861828 Share on other sites More sharing options...
PugJr Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 Hey, if you are going to work for her for free, I have a job for you. Contact me if you are interested, this will be a full time job. Sorry, no fresh fruits. Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/163259-question-about-rates/#findComment-862190 Share on other sites More sharing options...
.josh Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 What about bagels? I like "everything" bagels with chive and onion cream cheese kkthnx. Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/163259-question-about-rates/#findComment-862194 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsschmitt Posted June 23, 2009 Author Share Posted June 23, 2009 Hey, if you are going to work for her for free, I have a job for you. Contact me if you are interested, this will be a full time job. Sorry, no fresh fruits. The only work I did for free was base creation of the site, and anything that actually interested me. I did stuff in my spare time to see if i could do it, and it they could use it on the site for free. They never asked for the majority of things i did. You screwed up by asking me to for it ^.^ If you pose a situation where I am interested in figuring it out, as long as I can keep and use whatever I come up with (and haven't already done it) the work is pro bono... Why? Because I want to learn, and establish a base of what I can do... Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/163259-question-about-rates/#findComment-862250 Share on other sites More sharing options...
.josh Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 sarchasm ftw. Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/163259-question-about-rates/#findComment-862251 Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomfmason Posted June 23, 2009 Share Posted June 23, 2009 I don't really do much freelancing any more but when I do I almost always follow the same process for determining the bid. Here are the questions I always ask my self when working out a bid(assuming solo project obviously) 1) What hourly rate is fair for the work? - Some work is harder,more stressful etc than others. So, naturally a "fair" hourly rate depends on the hassle involved. For example, I am likely to charge 1.5-2x higher hourly rate for working with an existing code base or if the client is annoying. 2)What features are required and how long will it take me for complete those feature? Once I figure out my hourly and have a good estimate of the time required to complete the work I normally add 5-10 hours to that because things rarely, if ever, work out as I planned. Quote Link to comment https://forums.phpfreaks.com/topic/163259-question-about-rates/#findComment-862288 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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