OM2 Posted April 19, 2010 Share Posted April 19, 2010 I'm looking to skill myself up and looking to polish up my PHP skills, which are basic at the moment But, someone told me that PHP is a shrinking market - jobs are out there, but less of them And that .net was the way to go I have a friend who runs a recruitment company - all he has is .net jobs - apparently the world is crying out for .net developers! .net: I know nothing about PHP: I know a lot about - I've been doing bits of coding here and there - only very small things Which should I concentrate on? Maybe asking on a PHP forum I will get a biased answer I thought I'd try asking anyway Just wanted to know what others here thought? Thanks OM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zq29 Posted April 19, 2010 Share Posted April 19, 2010 It never hurts to know more than one language Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ignace Posted April 19, 2010 Share Posted April 19, 2010 Do not bother to learn .NET it's Windows-only (or waste-of-your-time) learn Java; experiment with C++ and learn how a language works with Assembler. Afterwards it's best to take a peek at Ruby, Python & Perl (Perl preferably last). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevinM1 Posted April 19, 2010 Share Posted April 19, 2010 Do not bother to learn .NET it's Windows-only (or waste-of-your-time) Real bad advice. In my area of the world, unless you're freelancing, you're writing ASP.NET. There's no value in limiting yourself to just open source. All you're doing is limiting your potential income. There's no cost for the developer to write .NET apps. Microsoft is very good to their developers, and offer a host of free IDEs that work very well (google Visual Studio Express). They also have great deals for small business owners. I currently have a three year subscription to the MSDN, including full downloads of their professional development software, and I'm practically getting it for free - $100 fee after my three years are up, and some hosting costs, that's it. I get the whole "Microsoft sucks" argument. I wouldn't pay the kinds of costs it normally takes to host an ASP.NET site either. But, that's not the point. Other people do, and will, and I'm in a position to capitalize on that. To the OP, here's my advice: Keep up with your PHP. PHP isn't going anywhere - look at Facebook for a recent example of a large, profitable website written in PHP. Learn ASP.NET with C# as your code-behind language - both traditional web forms and the new MVC framework. Finally learn Python, and the Django framework. It's the new hotness. That should keep you in good shape. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OM2 Posted April 19, 2010 Author Share Posted April 19, 2010 Nightslyr: thanks, that's great advice the thing is:i *really* want to focus on ONE or TWO things ONLY and really master those at hte moment, i'm a complate overall genius - i know bits of everything but when it comes to getting a job, i mostly find that employers want *specific* skillsets i am not a master in any of the technologies so... given the popularity of .net, i am thinking i might as well switch tot his - even though i have no experience at this momnet in time i'm an exprienced programmer (in many languages!), so it should take too long to pick up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ignace Posted April 19, 2010 Share Posted April 19, 2010 I get the whole "Microsoft sucks" argument. Not from me you won't. These comments mostly come from people using Apple products but in recent news has proven that these so called god-like products don't live up to their made-up reputation: http://www.cultofmac.com/macbook-air-so-hot-it-burns/38182 I'm not so hyped around OS systems, I'll sail if it floats Although my job requires the use of multiple (popular) OS systems for mere browser-testing. In my part of the world 3/4 of the programmer jobs are Java, 1/4 is ASP.NET (probably due to the high license costs) anyway my advice was purely based on deployment options rather then employment although Java, PHP, Ruby & Python make a good skill-set any day. PS I'm not a fan of VB.NET and probably never will be and I will be glad to pass along anyone asking for a VB.NET professional to your office Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel0 Posted April 19, 2010 Share Posted April 19, 2010 Do not bother to learn .NET it's Windows-only [...] Oh really? http://www.mono-project.org Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seventheyejosh Posted April 19, 2010 Share Posted April 19, 2010 Oh really? http://www.mono-project.org Damn, I love your sudden bits of knowledge! Not that this one in particular is of any use to me, but it is always interesting seeing you swoop in and derail a topic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oni-kun Posted April 20, 2010 Share Posted April 20, 2010 Oh really? http://www.mono-project.org An open source x-platform implementation isn't .NET, Especially in the job market. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel0 Posted April 20, 2010 Share Posted April 20, 2010 Oh really? http://www.mono-project.org An open source x-platform implementation isn't .NET, Especially in the job market. That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that just because he is using .NET on his job doesn't mean he cannot use .NET or C# in his free time on a Linux box. You can actually compile something with Mono on Linux, move it to a computer running Windows and execute it directly just by double clicking on the file's icon. Also, people running Ubuntu (or just Gnome maybe?) will already have a couple of applications installed that are written using Mono. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
salathe Posted April 20, 2010 Share Posted April 20, 2010 I can't honestly say I have a good overview of the job market but I would be *very* surprised if the only jobs available, as your recruiting friend says, are .NET-related. Back when I was looking for work, specifically in PHP, there was a tonne of jobs in many sectors: of course .NET was popular (is that a good or bad thing, is there a lot of work, lack of workers, low job-retention?..) but I was able to find plenty of jobs all over the country for PHP, Python, basic web, loads for Java, and so on. I wouldn't base which language(s) to specialise in solely on current job availability! Find one (for now) that particularly interests you and if you do become a "master" in it there will always (unless it's some obscure, esoteric language) be work there. I would also advise against becoming a "master" of one thing to the exclusion of anything else; do keep up with a wide variety (not just programming language syntax, techniques, etc.) of topics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OM2 Posted April 20, 2010 Author Share Posted April 20, 2010 salathe: that's great advice i'll definitely put my head down and master at least one or 2 technologies + stay abreast of most other things Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ignace Posted April 20, 2010 Share Posted April 20, 2010 Do not bother to learn .NET it's Windows-only [...] Oh really? http://www.mono-project.org Yes partial solutions for .NET-companies to be finally competitive with companies using Linux and Java, which pay 0 on licensing fees for both the OS and IDE (and it becomes even worse if they develop ASP.NET applications MS charges for that to). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tibberous Posted April 20, 2010 Share Posted April 20, 2010 Do not bother to learn .NET it's Windows-only (or waste-of-your-time) There's no value in limiting yourself to just open source. All you're doing is limiting your potential income. Your income is limited by your available hours. You can get a job doing PHP, you can get a job doing .NET, but imo it would be better to be good at one or the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seventheyejosh Posted April 20, 2010 Share Posted April 20, 2010 I have to say that to me, it makes more sense to learn one language of a group, then master and excel at it. Php, ASP, etc are Web languages, choose one. Or learn related languages. C, Obj-C, C++, choose the parent ©, then a child. Or a language then a framework. Javascript, prototype, mootools, jquery (latter 3 are frameworks for javascript). And to a lesser extend a query language: MSSql / MySql. Etc, etc... It just seems that it is better to be a master of one trade, then a jack of all, or however that saying goes. Now it obviously isn't as black and white as I've painted it, and I've hardly followed this, but you can see how it lays out to me, having dabbled in a bunch (too many ) - Josh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ignace Posted April 20, 2010 Share Posted April 20, 2010 it makes more sense to learn one language of a group Some good advice. I generally try to learn and explore multiple languages in one area/group (web for example) and adjust according to the project requirements although I'm biased towards free, open-source languages. You will not easily find me learning a language that isn't open-source. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevinM1 Posted April 21, 2010 Share Posted April 21, 2010 Do not bother to learn .NET it's Windows-only (or waste-of-your-time) There's no value in limiting yourself to just open source. All you're doing is limiting your potential income. Your income is limited by your available hours. You can get a job doing PHP, you can get a job doing .NET, but imo it would be better to be good at one or the other. This is a bit of a truism. One will naturally be better at using one language over the others. The point is to not be better at one at the expense of the others. In New England, .NET is where the money is. However, due to the crappy economy, competition in that job market is high. The backup plan? PHP. Being comfortable (admittedly, with a different level of comfort depending on language) in both allows me to make money where others may not. It's all about being flexible, and making yourself more likely to thrive in conditions where others may fail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevinM1 Posted April 21, 2010 Share Posted April 21, 2010 PS I'm not a fan of VB.NET and probably never will be and I will be glad to pass along anyone asking for a VB.NET professional to your office I don't think anyone is a fan of VB.NET. C# is where it's at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ignace Posted April 21, 2010 Share Posted April 21, 2010 It's all about being flexible, and making yourself more likely to thrive in conditions where others may fail. And this is easier then you might think as most employed professionals (at least most of whom I know) still sit-on-top of the (outdated) experience they gained in school and throughout their careers. They only take a training whenever the company think they should (and pays for it)... unbelievable. To me programmers in theory but not in practice. Programming is a way of living not a 9-to-5 job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonnoTheDev Posted April 21, 2010 Share Posted April 21, 2010 Programming is a way of living not a 9-to-5 job. Really. Do you get paid before 9 and after 5? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seventheyejosh Posted April 21, 2010 Share Posted April 21, 2010 Programming is a way of living not a 9-to-5 job. I have to agree! I've recently finished all of my current side work, and have no active projects... I can't even sleep at night! It has been like 2 years since I had nothing to work on after work! The girlfriend loves it, but I can't sleep or focus with all the silence in my head! Nothing to process on the back burner!!! I'm sure it will all change soon and I'll be pining for some relaxation time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonnoTheDev Posted April 21, 2010 Share Posted April 21, 2010 I think you have OCD! Get a hobby away from a computer. Computers rot your brain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel0 Posted April 21, 2010 Share Posted April 21, 2010 Programming is a way of living not a 9-to-5 job. Sorry but, no it isn't. It may be to you, but not in the general sense. It is entirely possible being good at your job without making it your entire life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonnoTheDev Posted April 21, 2010 Share Posted April 21, 2010 Sorry but, no it isn't. It may be to you, but not in the general sense. It is entirely possible being good at your job without making it your entire life. Absolutely. You would not have a life if it was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seventheyejosh Posted April 21, 2010 Share Posted April 21, 2010 I guess I should clarify.. I'm not a basement dweller. I am a passionate yard man, I love my grass and garden. I play guitar. The woman and I are constantly remodeling the house. I go lots of places. I have a great life, and great friends. But, I always have programming at least on the back of my mind. It is fun, and challenging, and I love it. I love running into brick walls and just thinking through them. Google for a bit to build an approach, then let it stew in the back of the mind for a day or two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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