[SOLVED] Programmers Assistant version 2.5

[Ninjakreborn]

http://www.freelancebusinessman.com/personalprojects/framework/framework.php
It's there in the zip file.
I just wanted someone to do some testing, so I can make adjustments where necessary.

[ober]

Framework for what?  If you want us to test something, make a demo out of it.  I'm not going to download something and install it just to test it for you.

Also, your spelling and grammar sucks on that page.  You might want to re-write it.

[Ninjakreborn]

I will be rewriting for it, the page I just put up in a few minutes.  It was jsut something I am trying to go open source, the nature of it can't be put in a demo, and be shown.  It's more of a thing for developer's to help them build websites.

[trq]

Man, I don't want to start here but seriously... that just seems like bits and pieces of an unfinished application. How the hell does that all tie together into a framework?

Have you ever looked at any of the frameworks around? What you have here is a small collection of functions, not even what Id'e call a library, a framework it is not.

[redbullmarky]

dude, like thorpe said - go download a proper framework. codeigniter and cakephp are both great, like i've mentioned to you before.

in some ways, and possibly in your defence, maybe you've picked the wrong audience to look over it. what we've seen recently is plenty of posts regarding plenty of confusion, including the bit where you had your secretefeedback site ripped open like a prisoners buttcheeks. it's hardly been a rocking good advert for your framework.

css styles should not be part of a framework, nor should anything else project-specific. a framework is generally a collection of common, reusable functions/classes, etc, all working in perfect harmony to actually make sure that applications run quickly, smoothly and securely.

you need to do some work, and (for the time being) just get on with earning money for yourself. Only once you've semi-mastered a "proper" framework will you truly appreciate what a framework is and what it's supposed to achieve.

People need to see some proper stuff built WITH it, to see what it can truly do, before they'll even take a sniff.

[b]edit[/b]: here's another example of what's wrong (taken from forms.inc.php):
[quote]
This function may need to be modified slightly on a project to project basis, but for now...
[/quote]
which, to be honest, defeats the whole point of what a framework is all about. if things need tweaking project by project, then wrap it in a class and use variables to alter its functionality, or use a seperate 'config' file that holds settings for things like this, so someone using your f/w doesnt need to keep peering into all these scripts changing things around. If that's the case, then they may as well not both using a framework at all or just write their own.

[Ninjakreborn]

The framework, isn't something I am selling.  It isn't something I am replicating for other people to use.  It's something I am offering people if they want to try it, and/or offer feedback about it.
The reason I think this, is with my framework, the entire thing was for me, for my projects.
It's constantly under development.
I thank you for the standard criticism, and I will keep it in mind.  I will also be releasing another version soon, that will be huge rewrites, stuff I am doing on it in the next week.  Thanks for the feedback.

[steelmanronald06]

Basically, you have created a library of functions.  A framework is much more than that.  Right now you are building a house and this that you have is the nails.  A framework is the hammer, nails, nail gun, wood glue, cutting saws, etc.  It is EVERYTHING.  It does all the work for you so you don't have to.  I have been studying frameworks for over a week now, and I still know shit about them. It takes time, patience, and lots of reading. I didn't start messing with cakephp till I read the manual front to back, and started learning MVC.  Here is what you need:

1) Learn MVC till you can do it in your sleep.
2) Get really good with OOP.  It is that which makes a framework tick.
3) Learn Design Patterns.  Until you do, the framework will be hard to manage. D/P keeps your framework in order so you know what you have and what you need to add.

Hope this helps.

[Ninjakreborn]

Thank you for all the advice. 
I guess I should have rephrased it
At this stage I am not ready to get into those specific things, thank you for the checklist of the things TOO get into when I start going in that direction, but procedural seems to be doing what I need for the time being, I will be heading off into those directions shortly, but I more of like having fun as I go, taking my entire. Working for a living, and enjoying what I do, right now, I enjoy where I am at.  The OOP I am heading into I am really looking forward to getting heavily into, and really soaking it up, but that will be another couple of months atleast

I think the purpose of my framework was misunderstood.
I wasn't releasing it, it's not a negative to try and show my stuff off, to help people.
I find it useful, If I was taking 1-2 weeks to build a site, now a lot of the heavier stuff my framework does for me at first.  Auto-creating an admin form, making it easy to change and manipulate variables, a place for me to work on, create, and test functions.  This is what I made if for, I offer it as a free download so if anyone has any feature advice, and other stuff then they can.  in the meantime it's here for me, and for me to have fun building, each project making it better, more secure, stronger, and better. Hopefully getting some helpful comments about it over time.

[ober]

You're missing the point.  STOP CALLING IT A FRAMEWORK.  At most, I suggest you refer to it as your "library".

[Ninjakreborn]

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=define%3A+framework&btnG=Google+Search
Ok, instead of me just shooting out opinions, let me tell you how I feel about this, as a whole.

I enjoy what I do, so I started up my program.
I call it a framework,because technically, it is for me.  Maybe my style of programming is different from everyone else out there then, but I do everything by hand, I didn't want something with a graphical interface, it's made to be used by developers, with developing.
Granted, it's not the best yet, but it has literally triple decreased my time frame of finishing projects.

Here
[quote]In software development, a Framework is a defined support structure in which another software project can be organized and developed. Typically, a framework may include support programs, code libraries and a scripting language amongst other software to help develop and glue together the different components of your project.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Framework[/quote]
That is what I consider it.  Right now, it's a support structure, that my other programs, and website constructions tools are built into.  It's not something I am doing as an open source project, but more of something I am using, and will always be using, and every project I make it a goal to improve it, I thought I would just share it with people.
I have the thing up there.  code libraries will be built in over time, as I create them.  1 support program (admin program)< I have already created and built into it.  Code libraries, are coming.  It's glued together with a config file, as well as a place to hold my functions.  Later it will have php functions, Javascript, ajax related functions, and other stuff, that I re-use, and maybe as versions increase other people will find usefull.  That is the purpose of me having this here, as well as the purpose for me putting it out there.

[steelmanronald06]

[quote author=ober link=topic=120884.msg497046#msg497046 date=1167945574]
You're missing the point.  STOP CALLING IT A FRAMEWORK.  At most, I suggest you refer to it as your "library".
[/quote]

Yeah, it is a library.  Just take my suggestions.  I personally don't think your at the stage where you need to build a framework.  I'm not at a stage to build a framework just because there is so much you have to know before you can even start.  Honestly, what you have here is good.  Most people shouldn't attempt to build a framework unless they can build a function library, but I wouldn't consider it a framework just because it is much more complex than what you have made it.  But keep trying.  You will get it in time.

*EDIT* Just read your reply. Must have sent it shortly before me.  No one is dogging your work. It is some really good work, and it shows that you have a basic understanding of php and how to use functions and libraries to help make things faster.  But there is so much more to a framework than you have here.  You have something that controls the execution aspects of it, and something that controls the viewing aspects of it, etc.  It is a big project, sometimes taking months to get even a rough draft of the framework developed, and taking many more months of countless TEAMWORK to get a good framework ready for release.

[Ninjakreborn]

Ok, so I will keep building onto it.
Maybe it is time for me to get into OOP after all, but I see all these arguments over
Procedural programming vrs OOP concepts.
I am sitting here wondering which is better.  I see developers that do procedural programming for 3-4 years, and seem to be doing great.  Which one is better, even people who use OOP seem to only use it sometimes.  I have seen people say they know OOP, but 90% of there general development is still done using procedural programming.

[448191]

:-X

[ShogunWarrior]

Well when it comes down to it too much abstraction to objects makes unmanageable, hollow code as much as garbled procedural code does.

However, using classes can separate code into manageable units and avoid naming conflicts etc.

[Ninjakreborn]

Thank you for all the very helpful advice ,I will use that checklist to allow my self to better get into OOP, thanks again, I will be starting to study that shortly.

[Ninjakreborn]

All advice was taken to heart, I am going to stop calling it a framework, and call it programmers assistant. It's an constantly in-development tool I am working on, to act as a website creation tool, to help developers take less time doing repetitive things they end up always having to do.
Current features
* Easy integration into new websites
* easier control over certain variables
* Easy to install admin program (programmers assistant has all the files to run the program)
* simply documentation
* Built in tiny_mce file's to allow you to have the editor readile available when you are ready to start doing editing for text areas (I am in the process of constructing my own editor over time,when the need arises
* built in directory allowing you to easily hold all files in one simply to control structure

I am working on some new features soon, and will be re-releasing version 2.5 shortly here for testing.

[neylitalo]

This looks like it could be very useful, but I don't really want to have to dig through everything to figure out how to use it.

It's going to take quite a bit of grunt-work, but there is one thing you could do to add immense value to it. phpDocumentor tags in your code would make everything very easy to figure out. You'll need the phpDoc software, found at http://www.phpdoc.org/. Once you have it installed, it's a simple matter of adding the comments to your code and then running a simple command to generate the HTML documentation.

I'm not going to give you step-by-step instructions, but once you get something started, I'll be more than glad to help you figure out any snafus. Post in another thread, though - keeps the place organized.

One last little note: It is, technically, a very small "framework". Any library that can be used to make the developer's life easier is qualified to be a framework. However, it's not to the point where you can use it exclusively - so I would refrain from referring to it as a framework. Heck, I think the word "library" is cooler, anyway.

[Ninjakreborn]

Thank you very much.  Great advice, and good inspiration, that will be the very first thing I do, first thing monday morning when I start working again.

[steelmanronald06]

Yeah.  I like the name switch. Give me a few days to really dig into it and I will get you a full list of pluses and minuses on it.

[Ninjakreborn]

Whoa, that woudl be very nice.  It's something that isn't in constant development.  However it's something I Carry around from project to project, I am trying to make it better, and add to it, with each project, so I can release it each time.  A list of pluses and minuses would be a great way for me to fix it up, and add to it.
I wnat it to be somethign that can be used to assist with everything.  So it's going to be like a system that has programs in it, like the current admin program.  I am wanting to add a few new programs into it, and see how it goes, but only ones I think are usefull in all situations.  Like I was thinking of a quick url management system, project managmant system (basic), contact management system.  However I am not sure how many people would or wouldn't need them, so I would have to make them optional, and start out turned "off" then show instructions on how to turn those extra features not everyone will need, back on as needed.  THanks for any advice steelman you may offer with that list.

[corbin]

Just looking through it now... The first thing that struck me as odd was how it assumes it is extracted to /admin/.  Theres a config file that you can change the docroot in... But then in /programs/admin/index.php it has <?php require_once("../master/config/config.php"); ?>  Which would go up a dir and then look for master and then config/config.php which in my case would be wrong.  I have it extracted to webroot/master/ so for me it would be looking for /webroot/master/programs/master/config/config.php...

Also, you're functions all return errors and make them global... I think it would be better for the function to return false or true where you could write custom errors.

Database strings are escaped via
[code=php:0]
$username = mysql_real_escape_string($_POST['username']);
[/code]
But on most servers magic_add_quotes  is turned on so that would end up adding slashes twice so you should add something like
[code=php:0]
function escape_string($str) {
if(get_magic_quotes_gpc()) { $str = stripslashes($str); }
//escape method here
}
[/code]

Of course that would have problems, but you get the general idea of removing slashes before adding them I'm sure.

Also, it's mainly an OCD thing of mine, but the accesslevel column in the administration table is text based.  It's personal preference, but I prefer to make them number based so it's easier to set up access restrictions.

In all of your files in the programs folder you use require_once("../master/config/config.php"); but the master folder is not 1 dir up...  Its 2 in my case, and since that file is not included the script throws errors and the other includes fail as well.

If the DB conn fails it just returns mysql_fetch_array invalid problems instead of dieing and saying the DB was unreachable or something similar.

Oh, didn't see this before - "* Move the admin folder from the programs folder into the root directory."  I understand now that it is suggested to put the folder in the root, but I personally like keeping my root folder as clean as possible, and I think it would be better if the includes were more dynamic as to accommodate for this.

I'm sure if I scrutinized it I could find more stuff, but I even find things in things I wrote 10 minutes before I look back over them... lol

[Daniel0]

The reason of the directory "assumptions" might be that he initially intended it to be a framework which sometimes (or always?) forces a specific structure on you.

[Ninjakreborn]

Thanks for all the advice, yes I originally intended it to be a framework.  However it was nothing close to a framework, and when I really saw a framework that's not what I wanted, (I am still studying frameworks maybe eventually it will be), but for now, it's programmers assistant.  As for all the comments, thanks, I will fix all of these up in the next few days, I am following reds advice for the next project or 2, and using cake php, then code ignitor to try them out, see how they go (or use them on some test sites), then when I come back to my programmers assistant, I will be fixing all the things you mentioned above, plus building some new stuff into it.

[Ninjakreborn]

Remove this post if you want.  I am reposting (later this week or next), a completely new version of hte framework, rebuilt from the ground up, this version is obsolete, unless you just want to leave it on here for hte sake of it.  The url itself will even be different shortly.